I am new to this forum / group so I apologize if this isn’t the appropriate place to post this thread.
I recently took Andrew’s course on the Tibetan Book of the Dead, however mysticism and spiritual practice are not new to me. I have been meditating for a decade and in the past five years have intensely explored on a very intellectual level yogic practices of many different lineages. However this past year I have finally begun to experience embodied understandings of these teachings, much of which has to do with my recent decision to explore the realm of psychedelics, which I am now realizing takes the normal progress of spiritual practice into hyper speed, and last night I had an experience that I am tempted to define as “too much too soon”, but also I am trying to ensure myself that the universe wouldn’t give me anything I couldn’t handle.
Anyways, to get to it, I have been dabbling in some lucid dreaming practices. I haven’t had any lucid dream experiences yet, however during the day I have been asking myself “Am I dreaming right now?” and I’ve been putting a focus in my meditation practice on open awareness, and have continued to study the teachings of the Tibetan Book of the Dead and am currently reading Luminous Emptiness by Francesca Fremantle. So last night, rather accidentally unfortunately, I ended up journeying into a psychedelic space, and while i was there, I felt the experience of how it is true that we are dying in each moment and that in each moment choose to continue to engage with what we perceive as “reality” but that most of the time, we are making that choice unconsciously, but last night it felt like I was given the opportunity to make that choice consciously - whether to be reborn back into the realm of form. I felt the desire for form, both as an experience of fear of the unknown and also as an experience of wanting to “play” with form. At one point, I felt myself experiencing child consciousness and the phrase that came up for me was “I want to be where the colors are”. I also experienced my identity as Jewish as a “robe” that I could take off or on at will. Finally, I felt like I truly understand now that death is an illusion because I felt that continuation of awareness even when my body and ego and narratives faded into the background. They weren’t gone completely, but they didn’t seem so solid. There seemed a lot more freedom suddenly to “choose the narrative” I wanted to come back with as well as the choice to abandon all narratives, although I’ll be honest that choice seemed frightening and I ultimately didn’t make it.
Coming out of it, I feel “dizzy”. Suddenly I’m hyper aware of the “simulation” and am quite honestly ready to feel “normal” again. I want to engage with these teachings and have these experiences, but I also don’t want to dive into madness.
I suppose what I’m looking for is less advice and more just affirmation of my experience and also insights that anyone has from having gone through a similar experience.
Welcome to the Night Club side of things. Lots to unpack, as Andrew would start out. I will return later to do that. I believe I’ve had some similar experiences, so after reflecting, I will open the box and see what comes out.
Sujata, That is an often repeated story but the dosage seems to have grown in number. I was in an audience last year when a Rimpoche mentioned that he had been given/taken LSD but nothing much happened. I was surprised to hear this because I didn’t remember anything pertinent leading up to that, but that’s what the translator said.
I had many psychedelic experiences as a younger seeker. Back in those days LSD was high quality with no amphetamines so these experiences were mostly pure and amazing. We would trip overnight to experience the darkness and I went through many birth/death type journeys.
It was all about letting go completely of all that seemed real before …and being ready to completely embrace…a separate reality. To do this right you must be ready to embrace the letting go completely.
@amalieweil …I worry about the accidental nature of your experience as these things need to be well planned and well supported. As I look back now, I’m certain that these deep journeys to the center of my mind (so to speak…come along if you dare) were massively important in shaping me at that young age and in showing me the path that I am on now. They were like wonderful tastes of the chocolate…
As I look back now it feels as if coming out of a good LSD experience was always like coming out of a deep meditative experience…it stayed with you and left you in a kind of hybrid space where reality was now subtly different…much more illusory.
As Steve did, I also had some experiences with LSD and other hallucinogens in the '60s and '70s but it’s hard to remember anything life-changing or spiritual except that they did reveal deeper layers of the mind, or the mind with many veils removed. I had already been studying Dharma so I knew there was more to life than canned soup and crackers, but those days were a lot like today’s stressed-out craziness, except we had nuclear annihilation facing the planet and the call to participate in THE WAR, an ever present undertaking waiting in the wings. Unlike Steve’s experiences, for me, reality-altering drugs simply were just that, reality-altering drugs.
Over the past few years I’ve had a few experiences going on plant-sponsored journeys that have, once again, deepened my appreciation for what the mind is capable of, but I also did see some fellow-journeyers who could have used what Steve terms “well planned and well supported assistance,” because mind-altering experiences are within the reach of just about anybody these days (says my daughter) and I believe that just because you can do something, doesn’t mean you should do it.
If you feel you had an experience that was too much too soon, then it probably was. It’s good you realize this and can now, with this experience behind you, develop the NORMAL NOW you want to manifest. After all, it’s all (in) our mind. Put your intent out there and then live it.
Sounds very similar to Ram Dass’s story about giving Maharaji a handful of acid pills, he swallowed them all and carried on as nothing happened. I suppose if you’re a fully enlightened being, you can take an ego melting dose of the strongest medicine and it makes no difference because you’re already there.
Sounds like a very powerful experience with deep insights into the nature of reality! I’ve had several experiences that were so far out there that they took some time to ground and integrate.
I have spent several decades walking the psychedelic medicine path and also grounding it in regular meditation practice and grounding practices like walking in nature and feeling my connection to earth. Journaling after a journey like that can be helpful. Write about what you learned and how you want to integrate that awareness into your life. During my years of exploring the medicine path, I kept active and grounded in my work and everyday life. Pay attention to dosage, set and setting. Sometimes less is more.
Addendum:
(this website wouldn’t let me make another post until someone else replied). I just re-read that you “accidentally journeyed into psychedelic space”? Did you unintentionally get dosed?! If so, that is particularly difficult! These journeys are difficult enough even when intentionally dosing, but accidentally is tough! Sounds like you made the best of it and got some deep learning nonetheless! Great insights into how each moment we are dying to old identities and getting reborn into a new identity!
OK I just read the Scientific American story doubting the Ram Dass story based on Terence McKenna’s doubts about it. I doubt the doubters. One of my friends was a student of Ram Dass’s and went on yearly retreats with him. He believed the story and never heard Ram Dass retract it. Terence McKenna may doubt it. I met Terence in the early 90’s and spent a weekend in a small seminar with him in Portland right at the beginning of my psychedelic explorations. He was quite clear that for him psychedelics were not about psychospiritual healing or growth. He saw his psychedelic use as that of being a “psychonaut.” He believed that he was exploring other dimensions of the Universe, but seemed to have no interest in his own healing or spiritual growth. He had briefly lived in India and tried meditation but decided that it did nothing for him. Only the intense visionary states of psilocybin (5 grams of psilocybe cubensis in a dark room was his method) and of DMT held his interest. (Even LSD was not visionary enough for him). I decided that weekend that he was not my teacher. He had a strange mix of scientific skepticism mixed with very far out beliefs that he had received through psychedelic downloads - such as the idea that there would be some kind of singularity where time as we know it would end on December 21, 2012. He arrived at that through some kind of mushroom download that led him to create some kind of computer program based on the I Ching and this created a “time wave” that ended in a singularity on that date (which also happened to be the end of the Mayan calendar). In short the dude was . . . far out there. I don’t mean to put the guy down. He was a great entertaining storyteller and racanteur. He definitely had a way with words and was quite interesting and entertaining. There are a lot of things I like about some of his ideas, but I take it with a grain of salt. The point is, on the one hand he had this hard core scientific skeptic side that doubted Ram Dass’s story, but then on the other hand, the dude was waaaaaayyy out there! I also read later that in his last few years he stopped using mushrooms because his experiences had become too frightening (but he did have some final healing journeys right before he died). If I had to chose, I would take Ram Dass. I also met Ram Dass once briefly in the early 2000’s after one of his talks, just got to shake his hand. The man radiated pure consciousness! This was not long after his stroke.
He took a huge dose of acid, not only once but twice. Here’s Ram Dass telling the story:
Ram Dass went to India because he wanted to give LSD to a yogi and see what they thought of it. He met a young hippie Sadhu (Bhagavan Das) who took him to his guru Neem Karoli Baba (Maharaji).
